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Location: Designer Dog Controversy
Discussion: "Designer" Dogs?
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conexxions3 |
"Designer" Dogs?
Mar 24 2007, 9:18 AM EDT What most fail to understand is that almost ALL dogs breeds ARE DESIGNER Dogs! VERY few dog breeds are "Ancient" breeds. My little Italian Greyhound - is an Ancient Breed. My Beagle, is an Ancient breed (both over 2000 years). About 60-80% (my estimate) of dog breeds have had HUMAN intervention to create them! Why is it NOW that people are saying its wrong? Geez, we wouldnt have some wonderful, wonderful breeds of dogs if that had been said 50 years ago. Its not like there was some magic moment in time that it suddenly became WRONG to mix breeds of dogs. Sorry, i just get a bit irritated at silly things. 6 out of 9 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Anonymous |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Mar 25 2007, 6:30 PM EDT I agree with you, but I think the thing that most people get upset about is the fact that there are so many dogs in shelters without homes that are already mixes. It seems to be a separate problem to me. Something needs to be done about responsible pet ownership, which means spaying or neutering your pets and not letting them roam freely about (so that we don't have unwanted/unplanned puppies). Overpopulation is the reason there are so many mixes in shelters out there. 1 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Anonymous |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Apr 6 2007, 12:04 PM EDT "About 60-80% (my estimate) of dog breeds have had HUMAN intervention to create them! "You have your facts wrong, most dog breeds except for a few toys were created to help people, yes people were involved just as they were with your italian greyhound and beagle they did not evolve on thier own. If people weren't invoved in the creation of dogs most dogs would revert back to a dingo style dog or saluki/solughi type dog, People created these dogs for a reason, these dogs had a purpose besides walking on a leash and looking pretty. Your entire sporting group (Golden retrivers, German Short hairs, Wiemmerianers, Irish, Gordon and English Setters) all had a pourpose such as retriving shot game, and finding the downed game. Your working group (dobermans, great pyrennese, Saint Bernards, and Bernese Mountian Dogs) all worked as gaurd, protection or rescue dogs. You terrier group (Wire Foxes, Airedales, Norfolk, Norwich, West Highland, and Welsh) all hunted vermin and rid the farm of unwanted creatures. The Hound Group (bloodhounds, irish wolf hounds, scottish deer hounds, and Afghan hounds) were all hunters and chasers/trackers. They had a pourpose. Many of your other breeds from other groups had a purpose too, but today to many people don't allow thier dogs to do what they were created for. 2 out of 3 found this valuable. Do you? |
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abbyk9 |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
May 10 2007, 5:20 AM EDT "What most fail to understand is that almost ALL dogs breeds ARE DESIGNER Dogs! VERY few dog breeds are "Ancient" breeds. My little Italian Greyhound - is an Ancient Breed. My Beagle, is an Ancient breed (both over 2000 years).I have to disagree with your post on several points. The first is your statement about the Italian Greyhound and the Beagle - they are not a pure ancient breed. While they may have ancient roots, both breeds have been created, and changed by humans. Over the years, humans have established a standard to breed to, and that's the foundation of today's Greyhound and today's Beagle. And that's also getting to the point. When people create a BREED, they do so with a purpose. Terriers were bred to go after vermin - therefore they needed to be quick, agile, prey driven, and low to the ground. In all established breeds, a breed goal and breed standard are set, and if you have two registered, proven (titled) dogs, you have a pretty good chance of saying that the pups from the litter will comply with the breed standard in looks as well as function (save for genetic mutations and recessive genes). Designer dogs cannot be considered dog breeds because nobody is actually making an effort to establish new BREEDS. They are setting no goals nor standards for the hybrids they are creating. They are not picking dogs that have the traits they want to pass on, or the traits they want to breed out, because that would take generations of selective breeding. I have not yet seen any breeder of designer dogs attempt to actually do anything but breeding two random dogs and selling the offspring for big money. One exception I will note are the Australian breeders who started the Australian Labradoodle breed. They were looking for a smart working dog that could assist the disabled - but one that would work for people with allergies. Their breeding program is actually that - a breeding program. With set goals, a set standard, and years of selective breeding and genetic research. Which is something these "designer dog" breeders cannot claim. 1 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you? |
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mlhooi |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Aug 16 2007, 11:46 AM EDT "What most fail to understand is that almost ALL dogs breeds ARE DESIGNER Dogs! VERY few dog breeds are "Ancient" breeds. My little Italian Greyhound - is an Ancient Breed. My Beagle, is an Ancient breed (both over 2000 years).I agree with you. I am sick about reading posts from the KKK of the dog ownership community. When dogs mate, they do not ask to see each others registration papers or see the vet to check for genetic issues. Dogs are animals, and they will intermix if left on their own. A purebred is not 'better genetically' than a crossbreed. In fact, many purebreeds are nortorious for certain genetic dispositions that can cause problems e.g. eyes on shar-pei. Crossbreeds and mongrels are not cloned animals with inherent genetic defects. Animals evolved nicely before humans came along and manipulated the gene pool through breeding. It's called 'natural selection'. Do you find this valuable? |
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Chrisy135 |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Aug 24 2008, 12:05 PM EDT i think that its fine to breed designer dogs. The reason there are so many dogs in the animal shelters is because people aren't being responsible, and we need to make some way to stop it. I decided not to get my first dog from a shelter, because you never know what problems they have. I'd much rather get dogs from that knows what theyre doing, and can tell me the past of the dogs. My cousins adopted dogs. One bites people, and it only lets a few people pet it. The other, is the nicest black lab i've ever seen. It lets their kids dress it up, and is trained. With rescue dogs, anything could happen. Now, don't get all mad at me. I think that people should get dogs from shelters if they are able to, but some people aren't. Do you find this valuable? |
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martincn |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Aug 24 2008, 4:40 PM EDT "i think that its fine to breed designer dogs. The reason there are so many dogs in the animal shelters is because people aren't being responsible, and we need to make some way to stop it. I decided not to get my first dog from a shelter, because you never know what problems they have. I'd much rather get dogs from that knows what theyre doing, and can tell me the past of the dogs. My cousins adopted dogs. One bites people, and it only lets a few people pet it. The other, is the nicest black lab i've ever seen. It lets their kids dress it up, and is trained. With rescue dogs, anything could happen. Now, don't get all mad at me. I think that people should get dogs from shelters if they are able to, but some people aren't."If you get a dog from a shelter that bites, you have a problem for one of three reasons. First, the shelter notified the owner that the dogs was aggressive and they didnt care. Second, it was a bad place the dog was adopted from, and it didnt undergo the proper assessment before it was adopted. Third, the dog somehow picked up the biting habit after it was adopted. I dont which of these happened but I do know if you get a dog from a reputable shelter, problems like adopting a dog that bites wont occur. I am also pretty sure you can take the dog back if there is a problem with it, like biting. It works the same way with a breeder. If you choose a reputable breeder, you shouldnt have problems from the get-go, unless it is hereditary and shows up later in life, (which most good breeders will have a way of compensating you if this occurs), or it is a behavioral problem caused by poor training or something else on the part of the owners. However, there are also many disreputable breeders that can give you a dog that they claim to know the past of. I live in Pennsylvania, one of the biggest puppy mill states in the country. One of the biggest offenders of this, unfortunately, are the Amish. I know for a fact that they are breeding, for example, Boston Terriers that are not purebred. These dogs are AKC registered, and so are their parents, so you "know the history" of the dogs. What you dont know is that they are being bred with other terriers to keep the free-whelping, which makes more of a profit for the breeders. My point is, if you do your research, you can get the same perfectly wonderful dog from either a breeder or a SHELTER. As for designer breeds, they arent an actual breed until there is some standard set for the breed. You dont have to register with the "KKK" of dogs to do this either, since there are many other registries out there. Just dont complain when you want to be considered a breed and dont want to put in the work. Do you find this valuable? |
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martincn |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Aug 24 2008, 4:53 PM EDT "About 60-80% (my estimate) of dog breeds have had HUMAN intervention to create them! Why is it NOW that people are saying its wrong? Geez, we wouldnt have some wonderful, wonderful breeds of dogs if that had been said 50 years ago.An irritating yet silly thing is when people have their facts wrong. Most of the breeds that are popular today werent created fifty years ago, but rather much longer before that. German Shepherds have been around since before 1891, when a group of enthusiasts got together to start to form the breed standard. The Golden retriever has been around since the early 1800's. 100% of all dog breeds have had human intervention to create them, or they would still be wolves! (or coyotes, or whatever it is that science thinks they are linked closest to at the moment). And yes, all of these breeds started by crossing on type of dog with a desirable trait with another dog containing a desirable trait. When people complain about needing to see papers for dogs in order to breed them, it is to try to prevent the health problems that would be caused. In fact, dogs are bred smarter than people! If there is a dog with bad eyes, you dont want to breed it to another dog, so the genetic issue isnt passed on. With humans, this isnt even considered, since it can be treated. With dogs, we are trying to maintain genetics, whether it be two purebreds or a poodle and a husky. Why should these dogs mate if the outcome is sure to be riddled with health problems? That is an issue that most people dont seem to notice. Do you find this valuable? |
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Chiweenershnitzel |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Aug 24 2008, 5:33 PM EDT I know this might sound a little bit sad, but I don't really have a thought-out opinion on this subject. I guess you can take either side... we all have a right to believe what we want to. We have free will! I think reasoning on both sides is very convincing, but I'm just going to remain neutral... good thoughts, though! Do you find this valuable? |
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Chiweenershnitzel |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Aug 24 2008, 5:46 PM EDT "I have to disagree with your post on several points.After reading more info, I have to agree with you. (I had said in an earlier thread that I didn't really have an opinion on this subjuct, but now I do.) Your reasoning is very good. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
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martincn |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Aug 24 2008, 11:43 PM EDT Thank you! Do you find this valuable? |
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Chrisy135 |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Aug 25 2008, 4:35 PM EDT I don't care much about it, but i say that desighner dogs shouldn't just be stopped being bred, cause i love my Morkies! 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
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martincn |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Aug 25 2008, 6:07 PM EDT "I don't care much about it, but i say that desighner dogs shouldn't just be stopped being bred, cause i love my Morkies! "No one ever said anything about stopping them from being bred! We were simply saying that "designer breeds" aren't breeds at all, but mixes that fetch a hefty price. I have nothing against your Morkie, or anyone else's designer mix. I would rather see people look for a dog in a shelter before they turn to a breeder, but I also realize that a dog that would be ideal for someone may not always be available, so I have no problem with purchasing a dog from a reputable breeder. Puppy mills or pet stores are a completely different story, however, and that is a topic best saved for another thread. Do you find this valuable? |
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Chrisy135 |
RE: "Designer" Dogs?
Aug 26 2008, 7:47 PM EDT I just adopted a dog! He is really nice, but i don't know what kinds he is! I know he is german shepard, but i don't know what else. If you have any ideas, tell me! Do you find this valuable? |
